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robard

Playoff games

114 posts in this topic

18 hours ago, Greg81102 said:

You may be right, but what about season ticket holders who are big fans?  Its not good for business or the team to tell people to throw all this money down every year just for the possibility your own arena will screw you in the playoffs.  Really shows how much the arena cares about the team.  In my opinion, you need to keep your main tenant and fans happy even if it means missing a bull riding competition and a few $ signs.  The arena has to be a lot better off with hockey.  Look how hard they were trying to get another team to fill all the empty dates. It might not hinder your success much, but you cant tell me it wont turn atleast a few people away from buying season tickets.

Once the SPHL regular season calendar is published, team managements and the arenas will know when the playoffs are.  Guarantee your team will be in the playoffs on those dates, then book the arena. 

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I know some disagree but this something that could’ve been avoided. If I was in charge of the civic center I’d clean house with any and everybody involved in scheduling. 

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9 minutes ago, Greg81102 said:

  Hope whoever made this decision, a big bull from the rodeo takes a huge dump on you. 

:happens:

4 minutes ago, robard said:

 

 If I was in charge of the civic center I’d clean house 

If that happened, I'd hope anyone would clean house.

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The way it was explained to me was the Berglund center signed a 3 year deal with the bull riding and if I'm not mistaken this is the last year. 

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19 minutes ago, robard said:

 

I know some disagree but this something that could’ve been avoided. If I was in charge of the civic center I’d clean house with any and everybody involved in scheduling. 

I agree, what a way to treat your main tenant.  Your fans who have supported the team through a year and a half of awful hockey.  Not to mention the players who have fought back hard to be in the playoff picture to get shut out of a home game in the first round.  It might be a reoccurring thing in this league but i believe it's a bad business decision.  I  wish everyone would boycott the rodeo.  :2thumbsup:

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7 minutes ago, Greg81102 said:

I agree, what a way to treat your main tenant.  Your fans who have supported the team through a year and a half of awful hockey.  Not to mention the players who have fought back hard to be in the playoff picture to get shut out of a home game in the first round.  It might be a reoccurring thing in this league but i believe it's a bad business decision.  I  wish everyone would boycott the rodeo.  :2thumbsup:

Maybe the scheduler knows something the rest of us don't. Just Kidding! 

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4 minutes ago, Make Marky GM said:

Maybe the scheduler knows something the rest of us don't. Just Kidding! 

We are going to get some bull horns up our :censore: one way or another.  Either the Bulls hockey team or the real thing.  :crash:

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Okay, I am posting because I do have a lot of insider knowledge on these issues, and therefore, would expect everyone to listen and hopefully understand.

Arenas, are NOT built for minor league hockey in mind. These are entertainment venues. What this means is these venues are aimed at higher profile entertainment. Ford Center, Berglund Center, Greensboro Coliseum Complex, etc. are all entertainment venues for the cities in which they are built. Verizon Arena in North Little Rock is the entertainment venue for all of Central Arkansas. These arenas are booked years in advance, especially with certain events like Monster Jam, PBR, Disney, the circus (R.I.P. Barnum & Bailey).

With that said, these arenas have commitments from these events that will last more than 1 night, and will mean more $$ to the arena for it's overhead and operating costs. Minor league hockey IS NOT the event that will pay all the bills of the arenas. The problem is most arenas only think about making money. Arena operations is not meant to be a profitable business, but should they be able to use the profits to renovate or upgrade, then I support it.

The same applies to concert events, where minor league hockey teams will be ousted for those events.

Let's take my home arena for example. The Greensboro Coliseum Complex is the premier entertainment venue of the Triad of North Carolina. It is the biggest arena in the state of North Carolina, and yes, surpassing the PNC Arena in Raleigh with the NHL franchise and the Spectrum Center in Charlotte with the NBA franchise. Our arena has a maximum capacity of 23,500 people, one of the largest arenas in the entire country. For hockey, we can seat 21,273 people, and yes, the Greensboro Monarchs still hold the ECHL record of over 20,000 in attendance for a single game. Our basketball capacity is listed as 23,500 which is inaccurate.

Nonetheless, the GCC is a top choice for numerous events, on average 1,000 per year. We have Monster Jam, PBR (the actual professionals), Disney, numerous concerts and even stand-up comics, including Katt Williams, Mike Epps, Kevin Hart, etc.

Add in a new arena football team (which will fail), the UNC Greensboro Spartans basketball team, the ACC Tournament and even first and second round games of the NCAA Tournament, any hockey team would have no shot at being truly successful due to limited availability.

Even if on a night we drew 11,000 fans, and an average ticket price were $15.00, that would be $165,000, give or take. Compare that to an Eric Church concert that would be held that same night who drew 20,313 people, which is the 9th largest attendance for an event at the coliseum that is non-sports related. Say Eric Church's average price is $200, that would generate $4,062,600.

As an arena manager, are you inclined to throw away that kind of money? Our base price is $5,000 per event or 12% of ticket revenue, whichever is greater. So, let's do some math as far as what the arena receives. $165,000 * 12% = $19,800 for a hockey game, or $4,062,600 * 12% = $487,512. Which would you go for? Barely making $20,000 for a night, of making nearly half a million for that same night?

As with hockey, prime events battle for weekend dates also, mainly because that is when they can see the best revenue generated with people not having to work or go to school.

I know all of this sucks for fans, and as an avid hockey fan myself, I get butt hurt too, but in the end it's always about the money. 

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I understand and see that it's all about the money.  We have an auditorium right beside our arena.  They can schedule all the singers, comedians, plays, and all the other stuff they want in there.  They have multiple things going on in both venues a lot of the time.  But I can't see you asking season ticket holders and other interested fans to dish out money every year to support a team just to get shut out of your arena for the playoffs and not even having a chance to see your team compete. I can see the casual fans probably won't care.  But they aren't the ones there every game spending their hard earned money.  I never remember anything happening like this when we were in the ECHL and can't seem to find anybody in the ECHL thats had this problem by a search.  Yet i've heard plenty of teams in the SPHL this year is going to go through this same problem.  Most exciting hockey to see is playoff hockey when everything is on the line.  Just a dissatisfaction to the fans.  I'm just waiting for the announcement from the team if we do make the playoffs.  Going to be a lot of dissappointed fans and lots of complaining probably.  Not to mention, like Sova said the players are trying to take the news in stride.  They also get screwed.  Have to play all away games or go to Liberty which is over an hour away from here.  Not sure how many of our fans would even make the trip there.  Especially if it happens during the week.  So basically call it a neutral game.  All i'm saying is the fans deserve those dates to be open on the arena calenders.  Any way you look at it, it's bad business leaving your main tenant and fans out to dry.  You may make more money that night but your also going to lose some people who show up the most to the venue to watch hockey games.  Way I see it, whatever event your choosing over hockey will be there 1 or 2 nights and may not even return again, for what? Maybe a little extra money depending on what it is.  If they make so much money with the other events, why did The Berglund Center fight so hard to get hockey back in Roanoke?  So, just my opinion, but you should keep the fans and team happy because they will be there every year for atleast 28 dates.  We always talk about how unprofessional the FHL always does things, yet this right here is something you would expect from them.  Not a professional established league.  That's just my two cents on the arena situation for the SPHL teams during the playoffs.

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8 hours ago, HockeyRoanoke said:

The way it was explained to me was the Berglund center signed a 3 year deal with the bull riding and if I'm not mistaken this is the last year. 

Look up the date for the PBR on The Berglund Center website.  It states that this is the second year it will be in Roanoke.  So if your sources are right we just might be in the same predicament again next year.  Got to love that. :dizzy:

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SJSharkie hit it right on the head. As easy as it is to come into this situation with a hockey-fan bias, it’s just better business to book these 1-time events when you can get them and fill in hockey around it. The assumed long-term impact of fan support is negligible, which is why arenas continue to prioritize their scheduling in this way.

 

Regarding this never happening in the ECHL: it does all the time. BUT, one huge difference between the SPHL and the E (and even the AHL) is that the S plays only a best-of-3 with a 1-week window to complete the series, where the E and A play best-of-5/7 with a 2-week window. Thus, it’s easier to do creative scheduling in the higher leagues to work around an arena being booked for half of the series.

As an example, just last year Manchester hosted games 1+2 in the 1st round, then played games 3-7 all on the road at Adirondack. They won, and in the 2nd round had to play 1-3 at South Carolina before coming home for 4-7. In the 2015 AHL 2nd round, Hartford played home games 3+4 in Worcester and didn’t play on their home ice until game 6. I could provide countless others but no one wants me to bore them.

Acting like this is a unique situation is not understanding the annual minor league hockey struggle, but again, with a 1-week window, what are SPHL team supposed to do besides find another venue?

 

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Even though its only a 3 game series.  If the league would work with them we could have a home game.  Our arena is booked april 13 and 14th.  Im sure there will be games in the series other then them 2 dates.

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47 minutes ago, Greg81102 said:

Even though its only a 3 game series.  If the league would work with them we could have a home game.  Our arena is booked april 13 and 14th.  Im sure there will be games in the series other then them 2 dates.

It's not just the dates of the event that causes the issue, though.  This event scheduled is bull riding - not something like basketball that could be played on top of the ice.

I'm fairy certain that the ice has to be totally removed and then numerous  truck loads of dirt brought in.  Then the ice has to be put back in.That probably takes several days, although I'm not sure of the exact timeline - I'm sure others are better versed in how this would actually works.

I agree that it stinks (in more ways than one).

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What is the actual dates we will be playing the games?

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If and when the Havoc make it to the second round of the playoffs, the VBC won't be available for the Havoc, as Monster Truck Jam is scheduled for that time. As @Roanokehockey wrote, the ice has to come up, dirt has to go in, then clean-up and ice laid back down. So, despite the Havoc having YET ANOTHER RECORD ATTENDANCE :2thumbsup: (for the 3rd year in a row:

Huntsville   133,672 28

4,774- total, home games, average) 

even they can't get around having higher-paying events preempting SPHL hockey. Doc

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8 hours ago, Greg81102 said:

What is the actual dates we will be playing the games?

Basically the series has to be completed in one week.

My understanding is that once a pairing is established, the league looks at several things, primarily available dates and distance between team and then decides the schedule.

All things being equal, the schedule would be Game 1 at Team A, Game 2 at Team B, then back to Team A for game 3. 

But logistics might make that impractical so, it might be Game 1 at Team B, then games 2 and 3 at Team A.  

Depending on rink availability, there are all sort of permutations.  I think there have even been playoff series where a team doesn't even get a home game.

All those items may factor into the selection process.  A team might decide to pick an opponent because the don't have home ice. This is certainly going to be interesting.

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4 hours ago, Roanokehockey said:

Depending on rink availability, there are all sort of permutations.  I think there have even been playoff series where a team doesn't even get a home game.

Last year, #1 seed Macon played their entire 1st round in Columbus.

Good news for the future is that there will be a 2nd sheet of ice in the area. The Havoc moved last year’s 2nd round to the Huntsville Ice Complex.

By the way, surprised no one has mentioned checking the Berglund’s official schedule yet: they’re taking out the ice Mon Apr 2 because they also have Monster Truck when the Dawgs are in Peoria. So no, there’s no way to work around this and host a game. Rounds 2+3 look clear IF they can get there.

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9 hours ago, Roanokehockey said:

Depending on rink availability, there are all sort of permutations.  I think there have even been playoff series where a team doesn't even get a home game.

It's also happened where a neutral location between the two teams has been used. Certainly a better option than no home game(s) or even a rec rink with limited seating.

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I know the exact dates won't be known until the selections are made, but in general when would round 1 games be played? I am currently scheduled for vacation the week of the April 2-6 was planning on traveling to Peoria for our last 2 games, but am thinking about changing it to attend first round playoff games instead. And I can't remember from last season how soon games started after the end of the regular season.

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If the deciders can make it work, Lynchburg would be a solid place for the home 1st round play off game.  Its a newer building and has a big enough at capacity of 3000...nobodies avg. playoff  attendance last year was over 3000.   Only drawbacks will be no adult beverages (Fallwel's frown on that sort of thing) and most of the seats are bleachers.

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vicvegas - The last games of last year's regular season were on Saturday, April 8th. Round 1 of the playoffs ran from Tuesday, the 11th through Saturday, the 15th.

This year, the last regular season games are on Saturday, April 7th. So, round 1 will probably run about the same as last year.

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Thanks for the help Mac. I couldn't remember if that was the case or if they had an entire week off last year.

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"No rest for the wicked, and the good don't need any." ^_^

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