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ChompNation

SPHL expansion 2018-19

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18 hours ago, PlannedObsolescence said:

Possibly true, re: sentence 1. Definitely true re: 1st phrase of sentence 2. But ya gotta figger/admit that travel costs are a significant chuck of expenses, especially when travelling by plane, and not by bus, to faraway road games.

 

4 hours ago, JMC-STL said:

Evokes images of a team owner dumping a basket full of paper currency out the tail cone emergency exit of a Boeing 717.  money-with-wings_1f4b8.png

Oops. Meant to type "chunk". Nobody's perfect, and I never claimed to be. JMC, would that owner happen to be DB Cooper?

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3 hours ago, hockeydoc said:

They know I'm beyond help. I often joke with my ER colleagues and psych screeners  that there's a bed in the psych ward with my name over it, as a "memorial bed", and that I'm out on "work release". 

 

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On 3/15/2018 at 10:44 AM, PlannedObsolescence said:

... JMC, would that owner happen to be DB Cooper?

That was a 727; and besides, everybody knows "Dan Cooper" never existed.  Though there have been recent rumors that he is bankrolling the FHL:unsure:

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5 hours ago, Biottron said:

So no news on the Gators maybe returning? 

Haven't seen anything on that.

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The way I see it the SPHL is the future. It costs essentially the same amount to operate an AHL team as an ECHL team (prob 3-3.5 Mil) as opposed to an SPHL (about 1.5 Mil). SPHL has really developed into a very good brand of hockey and I would assert the casual fan can't tell the difference in play between the SPHL and the lower half of the ECHL

I think logical places to expand the league include: Quad Cities/Moline IL (Taxslyaer Arena), Louisville (Freedom Hall, maybe curtain off upper bowl), Lafayette (Cajun Dome), Columbia SC (Carolina Coliseum), St. Charles MO (Family Arena). 

I know unwise and rapid expansion was a key part in killing off the old IHL (well that and they wanted to take on the NHL, the NHL wasn't having it). I feel like the SPHL would be perfect at about 12 teams. Perhaps 14 teams 4 or 5 years from now. 

Thoughts from the Hockey gurus? from the ramblings of a newbie senile old man? 

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1 hour ago, Peoria Blades said:

The way I see it the SPHL is the future. It costs essentially the same amount to operate an AHL team as an ECHL team (prob 3-3.5 Mil) as opposed to an SPHL (about 1.5 Mil). SPHL has really developed into a very good brand of hockey and I would assert the casual fan can't tell the difference in play between the SPHL and the lower half of the ECHL

I think logical places to expand the league include: Quad Cities/Moline IL (Taxslyaer Arena), Louisville (Freedom Hall, maybe curtain off upper bowl), Lafayette (Cajun Dome), Columbia SC (Carolina Coliseum), St. Charles MO (Family Arena). 

I know unwise and rapid expansion was a key part in killing off the old IHL (well that and they wanted to take on the NHL, the NHL wasn't having it). I feel like the SPHL would be perfect at about 12 teams. Perhaps 14 teams 4 or 5 years from now. 

Thoughts from the Hockey gurus? from the ramblings of a newbie senile old man? 

Unless we're taking a very strict view of the casual fan, I will guarantee you they cannot *see* a significant difference on the ice. This coming from someone who views himself as barely more than a casual fan who's watched several years of ECHL and SPHL hockey. This is backed up by the volume and duration of call-ups the SPHL has seen from the ECHL. We haven't updated the charts, but at last look an average of 7 guys per team were "missing".

That said, I suspect the perception of the affiliations makes a bigger difference to the borderline fan. I'm in a bit of a hurry, or I'd like to explore that line of thinking more.

 

I think the SPHL can still invite intelligent expansion. I'm not prepared to speak to any specific locations, but if the rumors of QC joining the league become fact it does strengthen some new opportunities. The existence of several teams outside the far south footprint could change the economics for other teams in/around the Midwest. The SPHL has proven a willingness to play an imbalanced schedule to accommodate the travel, and additional teams would make that less wonky (sorry to get technical).

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Welcome to the Forums, Peoria Blades.

We've been shooting for a 12-team league for some time now, stuck in the 9-10 team groove since 2011. Those locations you listed have all been discussed here over the years, as have several others. It would be nice to see Lafayette rejoin the fold.

I'm concerned about stretching too far outside the main footprint. Even with the imbalanced schedule the league has employed over the last several years; until we get big enough to split into divisions, it will always be a challenge for the cost-concious. 

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7 hours ago, Peoria Blades said:

... I think logical places to expand the league include: Quad Cities/Moline IL (Taxslyaer Arena), Louisville (Freedom Hall, maybe curtain off upper bowl), Lafayette (Cajun Dome), Columbia SC (Carolina Coliseum), St. Charles MO (Family Arena). ...

Welcome to SPHL Forums, PB!

You can forget St. Charles as a one of the "logical places" for this League to expand, for at least the following reasons.

  1. No local ownership willing to step up: The most recent team, the St. Charles Chill of the CHL, had to be propped up by the owners of the Missouri Mavericks in an attempt to keep that league viable.  The Chill were one-n-done.
  2. The Family Arena is in a bad spot for drawing regular attendance: It's hidden away in the MO River bottoms between two major east-west traffic corridors, and even St. Charles County residents are hard-pressed to tell you how to get to it.
  3. St. Louis Metro hockey is and always will be dominated by the St. Louis Blues: Even with the recent success of local hockey talent in the NHL draft, those kids were only recognized for their future potential as major pro players.  Youth hockey has an avid but extremely small following in the area, and college hockey is non-existent beyond a few small school teams in far west St. Charles County & on the Southern Illinois side (all with very little fan support).  The NAHL & USHL junior hockey teams could not draw well enough to survive, and most current hockey fans in the area are unfamiliar with the former UHL team who played @ Family Arena (the Missouri River Otters).  The current market just doesn't have the "hockey bandwidth" to sustain a fan base beyond the ever-loyal Blues followers.

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I would also be hesitant to put Columbia on that list unless they get a brand new (i.e. non-USC) arena, the reason being that USC is notoriously difficult in terms of leasing to new tenants.  Case in point, the ECHL's Columbia Inferno, who were effectively booted from the Carolina Coliseum after USC decided that they couldn't move across the street to Colonial Life Arena.  Besides, even if Columbia does get a team, unless they get a new arena they'd honestly be better off at Colonial Life Arena simply because the Carolina Coliseum has a significantly undersized rink.  Besides, I'm pretty sure USC is planning on repurposing the place, which means it probably wouldn't be available anyway.

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I would also tempted to add Huntington, WV to the list for a number of reasons.  First off, the ECHL's Huntington Blizzard pulled SPHL-levels during their existence (around 3k) and with more room for marketing given that it's lower budget than the ECHL the possibility definitely exists for that to go up.  Second, in addition to the size of Huntington's metro area, it is also not terribly far away from Charleston, so given that the only other pro hockey team in West Virginia would be in Wheeling they could definitely pull from there.  And lastly, it would kind of bridge the gap between the SPHL's southern base, and the Peoria/Evansville(/Quad City?) northern section.

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On 3/29/2018 at 9:38 PM, p3tra said:

I would also tempted to add Huntington, WV to the list for a number of reasons.  First off, the ECHL's Huntington Blizzard pulled SPHL-levels during their existence (around 3k) and with more room for marketing given that it's lower budget than the ECHL the possibility definitely exists for that to go up.  Second, in addition to the size of Huntington's metro area, it is also not terribly far away from Charleston, so given that the only other pro hockey team in West Virginia would be in Wheeling they could definitely pull from there.  And lastly, it would kind of bridge the gap between the SPHL's southern base, and the Peoria/Evansville(/Quad City?) northern section.

*peeks around the corner* Did somebody say Huntington?:GoodMorning2: 

As someone who’s been chasing this windmill off and on for over a decade, you’re right on all counts. That, plus Huntington’s downtown is a lot better developed now than it was 20 years ago, are the pros to the argument.

The major cons, off the top of my head, are:

—the arena ice hasn't been turned on in 18 years and needs a not-insignificant amount of work, and to the extent that they’re making money hand over fist on concerts there these days, there’s not a whole lot of motivation on the city’s part to fix it. For that matter the city hasn’t had a permanent sheet of ice of any kind in over a decade.

—West Virginia as a whole has been in a prolonged downturn over the last few years; Huntington had been weathering it better than most of the rest of the state, but in the last year or so they lost their CSX division headquarters and another of their longtime industrial employers, Flint Pigments. Up the river, Ashland’s steel mills have been closing as well. (Counterpoint: neighboring Putnam County, a dual suburb of Huntington and Charleston, is one of the few truly prosperous parts of the state.)

—the whole “finding people with a big pile of money to spend on a hockey team in the middle of Appalachia” problem. Granted, this might be a little easier than I think, it’s just been a while since I’ve put effort into it. (I did start touching up my years-old notes and proposal—it’s gonna basically need a full renovation to catch up to 2018.)

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On 3/28/2018 at 4:08 PM, MacGuy said:

Welcome to the Forums, Peoria Blades.

We've been shooting for a 12-team league for some time now, stuck in the 9-10 team groove since 2011. Those locations you listed have all been discussed here over the years, as have several others. It would be nice to see Lafayette rejoin the fold.

I'm concerned about stretching too far outside the main footprint. Even with the imbalanced schedule the league has employed over the last several years; until we get big enough to split into divisions, it will always be a challenge for the cost-concious. 

Thank you for the welcome Sir.

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On 3/28/2018 at 8:35 PM, JMC-STL said:

Welcome to SPHL Forums, PB!

You can forget St. Charles as a one of the "logical places" for this League to expand, for at least the following reasons.

  1. No local ownership willing to step up: The most recent team, the St. Charles Chill of the CHL, had to be propped up by the owners of the Missouri Mavericks in an attempt to keep that league viable.  The Chill were one-n-done.
  2. The Family Arena is in a bad spot for drawing regular attendance: It's hidden away in the MO River bottoms between two major east-west traffic corridors, and even St. Charles County residents are hard-pressed to tell you how to get to it.
  3. St. Louis Metro hockey is and always will be dominated by the St. Louis Blues: Even with the recent success of local hockey talent in the NHL draft, those kids were only recognized for their future potential as major pro players.  Youth hockey has an avid but extremely small following in the area, and college hockey is non-existent beyond a few small school teams in far west St. Charles County & on the Southern Illinois side (all with very little fan support).  The NAHL & USHL junior hockey teams could not draw well enough to survive, and most current hockey fans in the area are unfamiliar with the former UHL team who played @ Family Arena (the Missouri River Otters).  The current market just doesn't have the "hockey bandwidth" to sustain a fan base beyond the ever-loyal Blues followers.

Thank you for the welcome Sir, JMC-STL, I was not aware of how poorly received Hockey is at a minor league level. Cardinals are Gods, Blues are Gods.......and apparently nothing else flys. I  just was basing my assertion on the fact that they were a vacated market with a very large and nice Arena that hardly ever gets used.  Jesssh, sounds like a boondoggle. I have seen it in person, and it is oddly off the beaten path, kinda wonder why it was built there.

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3 hours ago, Peoria Blades said:

... Cardinals are Gods, Blues are Gods...

Make that: "Cardinals are Gods, Blues are demi-gods" and you've got it right.

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On 4/3/2018 at 6:29 AM, JMC-STL said:

Make that: "Cardinals are Gods, Blues are demi-gods" and you've got it right.

HA!  that made me chortle. 

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Posted (edited)
On 3/29/2018 at 8:38 PM, p3tra said:

I would also tempted to add Huntington, WV to the list for a number of reasons.  First off, the ECHL's Huntington Blizzard pulled SPHL-levels during their existence (around 3k) and with more room for marketing given that it's lower budget than the ECHL the possibility definitely exists for that to go up.  Second, in addition to the size of Huntington's metro area, it is also not terribly far away from Charleston, so given that the only other pro hockey team in West Virginia would be in Wheeling they could definitely pull from there.  And lastly, it would kind of bridge the gap between the SPHL's southern base, and the Peoria/Evansville(/Quad City?) northern section.

Yeesh. Its a not well kept secret that Peoria didn't particularly enjoy the Wheeling destination.  I would add they didn't enjoy the ride, but then again who does?  Its the Minors.

Nothing was open late so the players would scramble to get first take at the buffet that was put out for them. LOL good luck getting a post game interview.

Carry on I have concluded my disparaging remarks for the day :) 

 

Edited by Peoria Blades

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On 3/14/2018 at 3:22 PM, AfghanPiehole said:

Winston Salem would be a great fit but I'm not sure how a Barry Soskin owned team would be very welcome in the SPHL.  I think it's worth a try and they'd fit in perfectly with Roanoke and Fayetteville as geographic rivals.  I know we used to have a really 'friendly' rivalry with Winston Salem in the past.  

The FHL team would have to fold before the SPHL would consider Winston/Salem. 

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11 hours ago, Peoria Blades said:

Yeesh. Its a not well kept secret that Peoria didn't particularly enjoy the Wheeling destination.  I would add they didn't enjoy the ride, but then again who does?  Its the Minors.

Nothing was open late so the players would scramble to get first take at the buffet that was put out for them. LOL good luck getting a post game interview.

Carry on I have concluded my disparaging remarks for the day :) 

 

Give Huntington this much--the food and nightlife is MUCH better. (At the very least there's a Waffle House on the way out of town, no matter which direction you head.) Add a team there and you can have a Restaurant of the Game promotion with no overlapping establishments.

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On 4/4/2018 at 7:27 AM, Peoria Blades said:

Yeesh. Its a not well kept secret that Peoria didn't particularly enjoy the Wheeling destination.  I would add they didn't enjoy the ride, but then again who does?  Its the Minors.

Nothing was open late so the players would scramble to get first take at the buffet that was put out for them. LOL good luck getting a post game interview.

Carry on I have concluded my disparaging remarks for the day :) 

 

I expect every year to hear that Wheeling is dropping their ECHL franchise. Their attendance would be in the bottom half of the SPHL.

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On 3/15/2018 at 8:01 AM, hockeydoc said:

They know I'm beyond help. I often joke with my ER colleagues and psych screeners  that there's a bed in the psych ward with my name over it, as a "memorial bed", and that I'm out on "work release". 

Wouldn't HIPPA laws make it difficult to have a bed with your real name all over it?

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On 4/4/2018 at 11:15 AM, Captain_Crosscheck said:

The FHL team would have to fold before the SPHL would consider Winston/Salem. 

No way that would ever happen in the FHL.

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